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What to do with Kelsey-Hayes Front Brakes (Read 14077 times)
OzJavelin
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Re: What to do with Kelsey-Hayes Front Brakes
Reply #15 - 03/18/08 at 11:45:21
 
Quote from OzJavelin on 03/17/08 at 20:58:52:

Does anyone have the dimensions of these CrownVic rotors do I can see if I can find a local equivalent?

Thanks,
Rod.

NAPA does! Smiley
 
OEM AMC
-----------
Diameter:10.97"
Thickness When New:1"
Minimum Turning Thickness:.94"
Height:4.633"
Bolt Circle Diameter:4.5"
 
'93 Crown Vic
----------------
O.D.:11.08"
Thickness When New:1.03"
Discard Thickness:.972"
Height:3.25"
Bolt Circle Diameter:4.5"
 
So .. the big difference is the "height".  Is this taken car of because you are using the drum brake hub which has the "desk height" set closer to the caliper?
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amx2334
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Re: What to do with Kelsey-Hayes Front Brakes
Reply #16 - 03/18/08 at 12:27:16
 
From the Raybestos website:
 
Part Number: 66276  
UPC Number: 030999311153  
Outside Diameter: 11.08 IN  
Manufacturing Type: K  
Composite Plate: NO  
Vented or Solid: Vented  
Number of Bolts/Holes: 5  
Discard Thickness: 0.972 IN  
Overall Height: 3.25 IN  
Overall Height: 7.03 IN  
Grade: PREMIUM  
Sub Brand: ADV  
Bolt Circle: 4.5  
Type: Disc Brake Rotors  
Thread Size: N/R  
 
Two different heights listed?
I can get the dimensions from a drum hub later today if you like.
 
 
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needafasterAMX
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Re: What to do with Kelsey-Hayes Front Brakes
Reply #17 - 03/18/08 at 13:01:13
 
I don't know were they came up with the Height:4.633" on the OEM, I will have to measure mine.
The main difference is were the hub face sits on the spindle .
 

 
short spindle on the right , Long spindle on the left

 
Drum/short spindle with new disk on left,  OEM Kelsey-Hayes disk on right
Its hard to tell from the pictures but there is about an 1/8 inch difference with the new higher and old lower.
thats why I had to take a little off the brake bracket to make up the difference.
   


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74 AMX, 401
Viper spec T56 6 speed trans
Hydroboost brakes with rear disks from a Avenger
3:73 TG rear now 3:15 with trutrac
A Turbo is in my future.
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OzJavelin
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Re: What to do with Kelsey-Hayes Front Brakes
Reply #18 - 03/19/08 at 01:46:29
 
'92 Jeep Cherokee
-----------------
O.D.:11.02"
Thickness When New:.94"
Discard Thickness:.894"
Height:3.095"
Bolt Circle Diameter:4.5"
 
Looks pretty close?  It's a fraction (2/13") shorter in height than the CrownVic disc, but .06" thinner in the rotor thickness.  Is that significant, or could that be compensated by keeping fresh pads in it?
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needafasterAMX
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Re: What to do with Kelsey-Hayes Front Brakes
Reply #19 - 03/19/08 at 20:31:32
 
You maybe able to get them to work, If they fit the hubs.
you would have to take more off the brake bracket and/or spindle to set them back, to center the disk were the old rotor was centered.
your looking at 130 thous difference between the ford rotor and the jeep rotor.
 
You would have to figure what wheel studs you would need to use.
Pads are know problem as long as you have the clearance  between the outside brake pad and rotor.  
 
 I looked through a parts rotor book and there is three or four rotors that may have worked, But the ford crown vic/ town car was the highest at 3.25 , So that is what I went with.
 
I put a little R and D in this brake swap. you will have to all so , to get things to work with the jeep rotors.
 
You guys down under don't have big ford cars. I thought they sold them every where.
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74 AMX, 401
Viper spec T56 6 speed trans
Hydroboost brakes with rear disks from a Avenger
3:73 TG rear now 3:15 with trutrac
A Turbo is in my future.
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needafasterAMX
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Re: What to do with Kelsey-Hayes Front Brakes
Reply #20 - 03/19/08 at 20:52:40
 
Update .
swap worked out good , easy to do and reasonable
I was able to do the swap and put four grooved and drilled rotors on for what just the 2 front rotors would of cost.
 
I just had to watch for caliber bracket to rotor clearance and out side brake pad to rotor clearance.
 
I had one side a little close on the out side brake pad to rotor clearance and it pulled to one sided .
 
Took the brake bracket down a little more fixed the problem.
 
Now on to something else.
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74 AMX, 401
Viper spec T56 6 speed trans
Hydroboost brakes with rear disks from a Avenger
3:73 TG rear now 3:15 with trutrac
A Turbo is in my future.
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OzJavelin
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Re: What to do with Kelsey-Hayes Front Brakes
Reply #21 - 03/20/08 at 04:58:57
 
Quote from needafasterAMX on 03/19/08 at 20:31:32:

You guys down under don't have big ford cars. I thought they sold them every where.

Unfortunately .. we only sell local "big" Ford Falcons, which have completely different brake setups .. Sad
Thanks for the info though.  It's given me something to work thru!! Smiley
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Re: What to do with Kelsey-Hayes Front Brakes
Reply #22 - 03/20/08 at 11:57:30
 
You need to take your pix, as many as you have, with as much detail as you have and write all of it down and put it in a booklet format. Have all of the parts needed to make the change listed (with part #s) and explain in details any modifications needed to make them fit. Make sure it's easy to understand format, so as not to confuse dummies like me, and sell them for 4 or 5 bux. This info is very helpful and worth the 5 bux. This is no get rich deal but it might help you defer some of your cost in all of the trial and error in making all of it work. This is AMC 4 wheel disc brake on the cheap.  I would definitely buy the booklet and keep it for reference.
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Re: What to do with Kelsey-Hayes Front Brakes
Reply #23 - 03/20/08 at 12:04:02
 
By the way I wanted to ask a question about the caliper mounting on the CV front rotor. In your pic with the new rotor with the caliper mounted it appears that the caliper is not centered on the rotor. Correct me if I am wrong but I am assuming that that is just an optical illusion.
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needafasterAMX
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Re: What to do with Kelsey-Hayes Front Brakes
Reply #24 - 03/20/08 at 13:18:17
 
Yes, it is a optical illusion. I notice that all so, and double checked that when I seen it.
 
(You need to take your pix, as many as you have, with as much detail as you have and write all of it down and put it in a booklet format.)
 
I thought about that and I may do something like that later and make it donations or what you said.
For Educational purposes only. of coarse  
But I would like to do the bendix , Kelsey-Hayes, and two rear brake setups, the rear I have now and the idea I have rolling around in my head for a difference rear setup that my be just about as easy as the fronts.(bolt on)
 
There is probably 50 different ways to do this with different hardware  
May goal is over the counter parts and use as much AMC as possible with out making anything.
 
I truly think that  AMC built a fine car. And what ever I can do to help the AMC community.  
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74 AMX, 401
Viper spec T56 6 speed trans
Hydroboost brakes with rear disks from a Avenger
3:73 TG rear now 3:15 with trutrac
A Turbo is in my future.
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crzee_27
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Re: What to do with Kelsey-Hayes Front Brakes
Reply #25 - 03/21/08 at 00:19:06
 
I don't know if I'll ever use needafasterAMX's R&D to redo my brakes, but, I want to thank him and all others that share with us to keep our cars rollin' down the road.  Smiley
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Re: What to do with Kelsey-Hayes Front Brakes
Reply #26 - 03/21/08 at 14:07:39
 
Vary nice set up front & rear.
After re-reading post you are just changing out the rotors up front and modifying the stock KH set to work right? On the 68-70 we need to change out every thing as the rotors are solid type (ok to use I guess?) calibers $600 – $800 for re-builds last time I checked and the pads you cant get.
Drum hubs I have but the rest of the KH I don’t. As you said “Might be able to use the Bendix” but as you see from above ($$$ & parts) I don’t think this is an option.
 
Can you tell me how is the Crown Vic Caliber attached does it use a bracket that bolts on that might be used or mod to work with an AMC? I would also use the CV calibers too at that point, will have to look up how much the calb. would be.  
See where I am going with this Wink  
Dave ----
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SASYAMX
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Re: What to do with Kelsey-Hayes Front Brakes
Reply #27 - 03/23/08 at 04:26:51
 
Would the stock disc brake spindles work on this set up or not , if not does anybody know some rotors that would work . Thanks
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Re: What to do with Kelsey-Hayes Front Brakes
Reply #28 - 04/10/08 at 18:56:09
 
I've messed with similar setups as this (old style 4 piston vette calipers and rotors on an AMX) and I've recently found that some drum brake hubs are shaped different than others.  the easier ones to work with are 'volcano' shaped, while the others are very square/straight sided.  Currently, we're working with some late model Mustang rotors, and they won't quite slide over the square/straight hub, but they're great with the volcanos.......................   My question is, "Which hub is what?"  undecided
 
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amx2334
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Re: What to do with Kelsey-Hayes Front Brakes
Reply #29 - 04/10/08 at 21:15:13
 
If this is what you mean by volcano it was on my 68.I have a 70 front end that has the same hubs.

To use the cobra rotor I had to remove a little from the hub register.You can see the file marks. I changed to a diff. rotor and now it's too small. The register is 71.5 mm before filing. I am going to get some hub centric rings and the new rotor should then center itself.
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